A mere Christian who values scientific and critical thinking. Mostly focusing on “woke” ideology these days, as such views are entrenched in positions of power (academia, education, most media, multiple corporations) and many in these positions of power increasingly demand allegiance to their values.
Essentially, I am a “live and let live” person. Have been for my whole life. But with the passing of each day, the “woke” don’t believe in “let live.” They won’t leave me alone. They think I must conform to their way of thinking. I must be like them.
Thus, I will employ critical and scientific thinking to expose their intellectual and moral bankruptcy. For there is one thing they do not have…….my respect.
Shadow To Light 
Hi there.
I notice a bit of regular traffic from this blog to mine, yet, I can’t figure out why. Any ideas?
By the way, I’m a fan, lurker, reader, etc. I think I may have left a comment or two on your stellar “Collins does more science than the Gnus combined” graph-post, but that’s it.
Any ideas what might account for the traffic? I’m just curious.
The obvious answer is that when you filled in your poster details, you also filled in your website details; as a result, your “cl” (at the head of each response you make) is coloured and underlined, and functions as a link to your website.
You are so F’d up. Atheism, as a whole, is a hate movement because you don’t like Dawkins beliefs? You _really_ are afraid that Atheists are evil incarnate. Every additional word you type allows your paranoia to fester, and you are gleeful when you can get 4 Biblically-blinded sheep to nod in agreement with you.
Your _entire_ Atheism collection repeatedly attacks the same tiny group of people while spouting “ALL Atheists are EXACTLY like these 5 guys”.
Your journalistic skills are minor league at best and I seriously believe you are probably the type of person I would not enjoy sharing a beer with.
Hi Martin,
That very last comment probably hurt Mike the most since his number one secret wish has been to share a beer with you.
That is one of the mantras of atheists, that not all atheists are the same, that each atheist is different; however, it is obvious they are the same, all under a siege mentality and react not with reason but with hatred against their critical observers.
I’m intrigued by your posts. I admit, I’ve only read a few of them, so I’d like to ask a few questions:
Since any atheism movement would by definition be “anti-religious”, would you flip that argument around and say that any religious movement would have to be, again by definition, “anti-secular”? As a followup question, would you condemn people of faith when they claim atheists are evil and immoral simply because they don’t accept a supernatural element in the Universe?
Is your opposition to atheism more an opposition to it as a (semi) organized movement, or are you opposing atheism completely? In other words, are you just upset about atheism when it’s vocal and gets press?
Assuming that you’re suggesting a discussion from a rational point of view, what would you like to see happen with the atheist movement? Would atheism be more acceptable to you if it were less derogatory towards believers?
What, in your opinion, differentiates the New Atheism from the old?
I’d really like to hear your thoughts on these issues. Thank you.
Hatch
Since any atheism movement would by definition be “anti-religious”, would you flip that argument around and say that any religious movement would have to be, again by definition, “anti-secular”?
If an atheism movement, by definition, must be anti-religious, does that mean atheists, by definition, are anti-religious? I know that when I was an atheist, I was not anti-religious.
As a followup question, would you condemn people of faith when they claim atheists are evil and immoral simply because they don’t accept a supernatural element in the Universe?
Yep. People are not evil and immoral simply because they don’t accept a supernatural element in the Universe.
Is your opposition to atheism more an opposition to it as a (semi) organized movement, or are you opposing atheism completely? In other words, are you just upset about atheism when it’s vocal and gets press?
I don’t have “an opposition to atheism.” I focus on a movement whose leaders argue, for example:
– being raised a Catholic is worse than being sexually abused (Dawkins)
– we should make it illegal to raise children in a religious tradition (Coyne)
– religious faith is a dangerous brain virus that needs to be quarantined (Boghossian)
Do you agree with these positions?
Assuming that you’re suggesting a discussion from a rational point of view, what would you like to see happen with the atheist movement?
It would be nice to see its leaders make an attempt at being intellectually honest. And to see both the leaders and followers try to practice what they preach.
Would atheism be more acceptable to you if it were less derogatory towards believers?
If someone wants to be an atheist, that is acceptable to me. What’s unacceptable is a movement of atheists built around hate, bigotry, and intolerance.
What, in your opinion, differentiates the New Atheism from the old?
Hate, bigotry, intolerance, extremism melded to the quest for power.
Michael: “If an atheism movement, by definition, must be anti-religious, does that mean atheists, by definition, are anti-religious? I know that when I was an atheist, I was not anti-religious.”
Hatch: No. Atheism is lack of belief. Atheists don’t have to be anti-religious at all. But when it becomes a movement there are certain principles that bind the individual members together. The belief that religion is negative would be one of these principles. Therefore, atheists movements are anti-religious.
__
Michael: “Yep. People are not evil and immoral simply because they don’t accept a supernatural element in the Universe.”
Hatch: We are in agreement.
__
Michael: “I don’t have “an opposition to atheism.” I focus on a movement whose leaders argue, for example:
– being raised a Catholic is worse than being sexually abused (Dawkins)
– we should make it illegal to raise children in a religious tradition (Coyne)
– religious faith is a dangerous brain virus that needs to be quarantined (Boghossian)
Do you agree with these positions?”
Hatch:I don’t know that these statements are takin in context (I doubt it), but that’s neither here nor there.
I don’t agree with the positions, although I believe that religious instruction of children does largely constitute brainwashing to a certain degree. I believe in freedom of thought and of/from religion, but I would rather see religion destroyed by force of well reasoned argument than by quarantine or legislation.
—–
Michael: “It would be nice to see its leaders make an attempt at being intellectually honest. And to see both the leaders and followers try to practice what they preach. ”
Hatch: Can you give me specific examples of intellectual dishonest and hypocrisy? It’s not a challenge, just a question.
_________
Michael: “If someone wants to be an atheist, that is acceptable to me. What’s unacceptable is a movement of atheists built around hate, bigotry, and intolerance.”
Hatch: Kudos. I’m an atheist and sometime blogger and I’ve been very critical of some of the louder voices in the atheist movement for intolerance and even dogmatism. It’s been one of my biggest topics, in fact.
It must be remembered, however, that if you are able to judge an entire movement by the words or actions of a handful of its adherents, then the religious should be subject to the same criticisms. That would lead us to ask why the vast majority of convicts and death row inmates in the US are Christian. But I welcome your pointing out things you think are hypocritical or insincere–as long as you’re being consistent and sincere yourself.
——
Hatch: “What, in your opinion, differentiates the New Atheism from the old?”
Michael: “Hate, bigotry, intolerance, extremism melded to the quest for power.”
Hatch: I have to disagree here. There’s nothing new about the “new” atheism other than the fact that it is largely unapologetic and unafraid to challenge the religious status quo. It challenges the silly notion that criticism of religion is somehow out-of-bounds in social discourse, as though the fact that millions of people believe something that is obviously untrue should be overlooked simply because that belief is associated with a religious teaching. All ideas are subject to scrutiny and criticism. When religion is criticized, its critics are called hateful bigots. When atheists are shunned or discriminated against, well, nothing much happens.
Curious though, where’s the quest for power?
—-
Thanks for the exchange. It’s nice to find someone on the other side of the fence who is willing to engage without losing their mind.
Hatch
I would go far further than thinking that the New Atheists have just one or two allies in the mainstream media. I see Harris and Dawkins as being the latest high priests for Western imperialism. Also Wikipedia is hugely friendly to them and to atheism in general where scientists who suggest that there may be more to life than biological machines are being removed from their pages. Witness Rupert Sheldrake, Tom Campbell, and the philosopher David John Ebert to name just a very few. We are on the verge of proof being given that life is not merely a material affair but the guardians of “knowledge” cling to their meaningless life scripts.
Hi Mike, I thought you might enjoy this humorous parody subreddit:
https://www.reddit.com/r/magicskyfairy/
“For example, there are a bunch of web pages out there that advocate astrology. Who cares? But if there was some type of Astrology Movement that sought to denigrate non-astrologers, and this movement was being led by popular authors and web sites, along with various members within academia, I would take notice. ”
Ever heard of someone called Michael Shermer or James Randi? They exist on this planet to stop nonsense like Astrology and have websites dedicated to debunking it, and even a published magazine that millions of copies have been sold… It’s a GOOD thing if there are websites out there debunking astrology, you seem to want to protect people’s right to defraud people? So let me get this straight, if there was a website out there selling illegal fraudulent MLM products such as a ponzi scheme that had no actual product (just like homeopathy is a fraud) you would NOT want a critical website out there to expose it? This “about” page really gives us indication how intelligent this website is you’ve created. You want stuff to defraud people….. how sick of a person are you?
Larry, it’s quite remarkable how little relevance your response has to the text that you quoted. Are you sure it says what you think it says?
“For example, there are a bunch of web pages out there that advocate astrology. Who cares?”
The apathetic attitude of “who cares” if there are a bunch of websites out there promoting fraud such as illegally selling products that make health claims (homeopathy) or even charging money for astrology readings, should be something very much “cared” about. Who cares if muslims fly planes into buildings an who cares if christian creationists think the earth is 6000 years folks. Big deal. Who cares. Who cares if 25 year old adults pay money at astrology websites an homeopathic sales websites – they are being defrauded.. Who cares.
Then the OP goes on to say he would take notice if there were astrology movement out there to denigrate non astrologers. Which is ironic considering religious websites exist out there to denigrade non religious people. It’s called: this website. But when non religious people make websites that denigrade religion, well let’s start a smear campaign, since we don’t really understand the difference of hypocrisy or hippopotamus. Let’s see, William Lane Craig, people denigrate him. Sam Harris. People denigrate him. Double standards?
A faith based fringe group website like “Embracing Faith” (at the top of this page) had a little temper tantrum when Harris wrote the book called End Of Faith and tried to smear Sam Harris as a scam artist. It is indication that your faith taken dearly to you, must be defended by a smear campaign against Harris, and a conspiracy theory of a website turning into libertarianism since someone’s domain name expired an they changed names. When MicroSoft changed it’s logo back in the 80’s or 90’s to Microsoft (without CamelCase) I guess it was all a conspiracy to fund Bill Gates. After all, when we are grasping for straws, what we can criticize is Project Reason changing to Reason Project, or vice versa. Microsoft becomes MicroSoft or vice versa. Conspiracy theory folks.
If Sam Harris starts calling his website ProjectReason instead of project-reason, I can’t wait to see your reaction and conspiracy. CamelCase? Dashed-Words? CaseCamel? Whatever Sam does, I’m 100 percent certain you’ll be critical of it because you had your faith questioned. Grasping at straws much.
Hi Michael, I couldn’t see a ‘contact’ link anywhere in your blog so I’m posting a comment here instead. I wondered if you had come across my book 2009 “Who made God? Searching for a theory of everything” (and its website http://www.whomadegod.org). Writing as a scientist and Bible-believing Christian who debated Richard Dawkins way back in 1986 at the Oxford Union “Huxley Memorial Debate”, my book sets out to show in a layman-friendly style, that the biblical ‘hypothesis of God’ (aka the biblical world-view) has far more explanatory power than atheism (especially ‘new atheism’). If you have not read the book I would happily send you a complimentary copy and invite you to consider reviewing it on your blog. You can check it out on http://www.amazon.com/Who-Made-God-Andrews-Edgar/dp/0852347634/ref=tmm_pap_title_0?ie=UTF8&qid=1307014305&sr=8-1 where there are 59 readers’ reviews and on the whomadegod.org website where there are some extracts. Many thanks!
Hi, I would like to do some cooperative efforts with you. There is a website that has some of the most popular anti-atheism material on the internet that I have access to. In addition, I have access to some of the most popular anti-atheism social media places on the internet
A quick follow up. I created an article on your website at http://www.conservapedia.com/Shadow_To_Light_blog I also contacted the Freedom From Atheism Foundation today and asked them to do a Facebook post on your blog. You can read about the Freedom From Atheism Foundation at: http://www.conservapedia.com/Freedom_From_Atheism_Foundation
In addition, I can help plug your blog in a significant way via one of YouTube’s most popular Christian YouTube channel.
I believe your blog and other efforts by Christendom is having a positive effect. See: http://examiningatheism.blogspot.com/2016/07/3-bad-trends-for-atheism.html Please keep up the good work!
The author of Shadow To Light – please contact me.
A blog post was created that is plugging your blog. You can read it at: http://examiningatheism.blogspot.com/2016/09/why-shadow-to-light-blog-is-one-of-best.html
Hi, I would like to do some cooperative efforts with you. There is a website that has some of the most popular anti-atheism material on the internet that I have access to. In addition, I have access to some of the most popular anti-atheism social media places on the internet
Hi Paul. I appreciate the kind words and offer, but unfortunately, I am way too busy to do anything more than I am doing here. Perhaps if real life ever slows down, I can reconsider.
Interesting stuff. You’ve given me a few things to ponder. I’ve often been struck by the tendency of ‘New Atheists’ to resemble the people they are criticizing. I will have to do a post on this some day. Paradoxes are my thing!
You’ve done a very well-done job. As a person who has friends who are both religious people and atheists, for me, it’s essential to monitor that they don’t fall into traps of extreme rhetoric of religious fanaticism or militant atheism. I remember once seeing the picture that says:
Normal people (religious/atheist):
“I believe in god”/”I don’t believe in god”
Idiots:
“I’ll prove you God exists”/”Science has proven God doesn’t exist”
“Atheists deserve to be burnt”/”Religious people need to be destroyed”
“Earth is only 6000 years old”/”Astronauts have never seen God”
“If there is no God, then everything is allowed”/”All wars are out of faith”
“You don’t believe in God, I hate you”/”You believe in God, I hate you”
Another thing I remember is talking to a person, who claims to be an atheist, and when I was trying to talk to him about believing on the terms of a debate, he said: “If you say about god once again I’ll block you!”. It’s aversion from the topic and this can give me a very firm point that he was a New Atheist/Soviet “scientific atheist”.
Similarly, there is a Russian rock band of two old women which sing songs that have very extremist lyrics. One of their songs is about killing astronauts because “they climb on the sky and do everything that’s not allowed by god”, science being “unneeded by god”, etc. Another is… “I vote for Hitler!”/”Children, church, kitchen!”. Weird, negativity-filled, ugly band.
So keep preaching and being public and critical!
The 2018 Global Atheist Conference was cancelled:
http://www.smh.com.au/comment/cancellation-of-atheist-shindig-is-a-disappointment-to-me–seriously-20171108-gzh3vh.html
The two headliner atheist that were scheduled were Salmun Rushdie and Richard Dawkins
See also:
http://examiningatheism.blogspot.com/2017/11/the-2018-global-atheist-convention-has.html
http://www.conservapedia.com/2018_Global_Atheist_Convention_that_was_cancelled
https://freethoughtblogs.com/pharyngula/2017/11/06/never-mind-2/
http://atheistconvention.org.au/
A news report about the cancellation of the 2018 Global Atheist Convention due to lack of interest:
https://www.eternitynews.com.au/australia/global-atheist-convention-cancelled-due-to-lack-of-interest/
Here is a key paragraph:
Robert Martin believes atheism, as a movement, is at a cross roads. “This is a massive blow to the Atheist Foundation as an organisation and to organised atheism in Australia. Where to next? What do they stand for?” asked Martin.
How may I contact you via email?
How may I contact you via email?
Under the blog roll, the 4th entry takes you to email.